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I do not know who wrote this, but my hat is off to him. I did however change it a little. I don't care who you are or how old you are, you have to see this. If you didn't live through this era, then it is your duty to learn about it and to remember it and to honor those men and women who valiantly fought for our country. Sons and daughter, never forget what your parents went through. People who lived through this horror, remember that these were our brothers, our husbands and wives, our cousins, our close friends, our school mates. These are all the people we knew and loved and we should never, never, never stop honoring them as the heroes they are/were. See this, hear this, and cry. You won't be able to stop yourself as you think of the people, both living and dead, that fought in Vietnam. No one was left untouched by this time in our history. May God bless all of your hearts and souls and know that we will never forget any of you or ever be able repay you for your sacrifice...
A Place Called VietNam
Some gave a little;
Some gave a lot;
Some gave everything;
We all gave something.


It saddens and upsets me when I ponder those people who did not honor our Country and our people at that time. We did not have a choice, we were serving our Country then as the men and women are serving their Country today in far away lands for my freedom and yours.
Gerald Hannah U.S.S. Orleck 1966-1969

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Wow. Nice. Everyone should check this short, to the point, tribute from the Viet Nam vets children.
Thanks for visiting my page. Glad you enjoyed my tribute. I did not write it, however I did edit it to fit my feelings. I do not remember who the author was. I am so glad that Douglas Karr had the foresight to start Navy Vets, it is so easy to navigate. Not to mention the freedom you are allow.
Hi, Gerald.
I tried to visit your site but could not get through to it. I'll try again in the future. I was never "in country" but I am a Vietnam era veteran. There was no room for nuclear subs in the waters of Nam. We kept a very heavy hammer over the Russian Naval Base on the Kamchatka Penninsula. I still will not watch a movie with Jane Fonda in it. I hope that I get to successfully visit your site.
Bill Karr
Thanks for the comment and interest. You are more than welcome to join if you would like. Gerald
hi gerald i just read your blrb on nam,it was moving. i spent two years in country,and a year off the coast on the ddg 4.ihave four children from 44 to 32,all they know about nam is that i was gone a long time.i have spent a little time in the physc ward and they just laugh about it.they dont give a dam about nam or those who were there. keep up the work ,it is people like you , that made that tour of duty worth while. j.b.atkinson / usn/ret.
I was born in 1968, Gerald. I'm probably not as knowledgeable about Vietnam as I should be. I do know visiting the Wall in D.C. put it into perspective, though. It's impossible to walk through and not shed a tear. My daughter will be there tomorrow on a High School trip - I'll see if I can't share some of the photos here when she returns.

God Bless,
I have not been to the wall in D. C., however the traveling wall has been to Millington, Tn. on three different occasions. I shed tears every time I visit it. I was one of the lucky ones all of my time two and a half years was on the USS Orleck. She kept all of us safe, we were only fired on one time and that was in 1967 during operation Sea Dragon. The ground pounders and the fly boys are the ones who had it rough, I had two friends who did not make it home. Both off the Orleck who put in for Nam.
Very nice dedication. I must admit, the only thing I know about the Vietnam War are the stories from veterans who were there that I have met along the way. Their experiences is worth sitting down and lending both an ear and a shoulder.
My father was offshore on the U.S.S. Hornet during the war but I know very little of his experience. Unfortunately, I will never get to hear from his own words what that experience may have been.

Gerald, Thank you for sharing and from a Veteran who comes from a long family line of Military men, God Bless you all.
As a Destroyer Sailor I spent a lot of time chasing Carriers doing Plain Guard detail about 4000 yards behind them.
I was very moved by this tribute and consumed the reality of a war I never fought in. I am a Vietnamese translator and did my first tour off the coast of Saigon in 1981 aboard the USS Monticello. I had to translate on behalf of the Navy after a rescue of Vietnamese refugees or Boat People. I went back to Vietnam many times since and I am moved by the presence of so many cemetarys,burned out tank shells and the tales of American courage by the people who are still trapped there.
Being the son of a former POW, I have my own reasons to cry when I see tributes such as this one. The levels of courage and the lack of respect towards American soldiers during those days just overwhelmes me, I wish it was more of the respect soldiers get today...
If no one has ever said this to you before,I want to be the first then,"Thank you for your service and the blank check you wrote for your life"!
I'm not about to try to check the validity of all this information. Take it as you see fit.


Room 7, Hanoi Hilton
In late 2000, Cdr Air Group (CAG) Jim Stockdale, Room 7 Senior Ranking Officer (SRO) asked his old friend, By Fuller to provide a list of the roommates of Room 7, Hanoi Hilton as of Christmas 1970. The roommates of this room were extraordinary, both at the time of incarceration, and then later in freedom.

Room 7 had the first organized church service to be held in the prisons of North Vietnam. Permission was asked for by Stockdale, and twice denied by the Camp Commander. The room was warned not to do it. Room 7 decided to do it anyway. They even had a choir. Their solemn service quickly caught the eye of the guards and authorities. Armed guards rushed into the room to break up the "ominous" unauthorized meeting. Ringleaders, Risner, Coker and Rutledge were led out of the room with guards at each arm (they were headed for more Heartbreak Hotel, solitary confinement and lots of punishment). Bud Day was the one who then jumped up on his bed and started to sing "The National Anthem" and "God Bless America." The entire room burst into song. Then Rooms Six, Five, Four, Three, Two and One joined in succession. These songs of pride and defiance were loud enough to be heard outside the 15-foot walls of the Hanoi Hilton. As Robbie marched out the door, his back straightened with pride. He held his head high.

Robbie later recalled his thoughts as his roommates burst out in song, "I felt like I was nine feet tall and could go bear hunting with a switch." Thirty-one years later, on November 16, 2001, a nine-foot tall bronze statue of Brigadier General Robinson Risner, USAF would be dedicated on the central plaza of the United States Air Force Academy. To Bud Day (principal speaker), Ross Perot (the sponsor of the project), and dozens of Robbie's Room-Seven roommates at the ceremony, it seemed more fitting to call the statue "life size." Photos: Dedication of B/Gen Robbie Risner's Statue - USAFA 16-18 November 2001

CAG, knowing what the VC reaction would be, was heard to remark something to the effect, "Well, I guess we just can't stand prosperity." Our camp, yet unnamed, from that moment on became known as Camp Unity. The guards protested, but the songs continued. Shortly thereafter, Vietnamese troops entered each room in force. They had their hats secured with chinstraps in place, they had fixed bayonets, and they were mad! They quickly backed the POWs against the walls with a bayonet in each POW's stomach. The singing immediately ceased as the troops burst through the doors. The VC later claimed that they had put down a riot. It wasn't a real riot, but it was a lot of fun until the soldiers entered the room. Several roommates of Room 7 were jerked out the next day. The next day, Orson Swindle in Room 6 tapped the following message on the wall: "Damn, you'd have to get in line to get in trouble in that crowd!"

Thanks to By Fuller for the gut work of putting together this facts sheet. Paul Galanti and Mike McGrath assisted. This historical document is dedicated to a fearless leader, Vice Admiral Jim Stockdale, CAG.

Here's what the men of Room 7 accomplished!

Roster of Room 7 on 26 December 1970 Hanoi Hilton
Name: Rank Days captive:
1. Brady, Al Cdr, USN 2236

2. Coker, George Lt (jg), USN 2381

3. Coskey, Ken Cdr, USN 1650

4. Craner, Bob Maj, USAF 1911

5. Crayton, Render LCdr, USN 2562

6. Crow, Fred LCol, USAF 2170

7. Crumpler, Carl LCol, USAF 1713

8. Daniels, Vern Cdr, USN 1966

9. Daughtrey, Norlan Capt, USAF 2751

10. Day, Bud Maj, USAF 2027

11. Denton, Jerry Cdr, USN 2766

12. Doremus, Rob LCdr, USN 2729

13. Dramesi, John Capt, USAF 2163

14. Dunn, Howie Maj, USMC 2624

15. Fellowes, Jack LCdr, USN 2381

16. Finlay, Jack LCol, USAF 1781

17. Franke, Bill Cdr, USN 2729

18. Fuller, By Cdr, USN 2060

19. Gillespie, Chuck Cdr, USN 1968

20. Guarino, Larry Maj, USAF 2801

21. Gutterson, Laird Maj, USAF 1846

22. Hughes, Jim LCol, USAF 2130

23. James, Charlie Cdr, USN 1761

24. Jenkins, Harry Cdr, USN 2648

25. Johnson, Sam Maj, USAF 2494

26. Kasler, Jim Maj, USAF 2400

27. Kirk, Tom LCol, USAF 1964

28. Lamar, Jim LCol, USAF 2474

29. Larson, Swede LCol, USAF 2130

30. Lawrence, Bill Cdr, USN 2076

31. Ligon, Vern LCol, USAF 1942

32. McCain, John LCdr, USN 1966

33. McKnight, George Maj, USAF 2655

34. Moore, Mel Cdr, USN 2185

35. Mulligan, Jim Cdr, USN 2521

36. Pollard, Ben Maj, USAF 2120

37. Risner, Robbie LCol, USAF 2706

38. Rivers, Wendy LCdr, USN 2715

39. Rutledge, Howie Cdr, USN 2633

40. Schoeffel, Pete LCdr, USN 1988

41. Shumaker, Bob LCdr, USN 2923

42. Stockdale, Jim Cdr, USN 2713

43. Stockman, Hervey LCol, USAF 2093

44. Stratton, Dick LCdr, USN 2250

45. Tanner, Nels LCdr, USN 2338

46. Webb, Ron Capt, USAF 2093

47. Gary Anderson Lt (jg), USN 2151

Total days in captivity: 108,116

Man-years in captivity: 296.21

Here's a brief history of the 47 men:

5 Made Admiral rank (Stockdale O-9, Lawrence O-9, Shumaker O-8, Denton O-8, Fuller O-8).

1 Made General rank (Risner O-7)

40 Others stayed in the military and attained the following ranks: (USMC 1 Col--Dunn; Navy 1 Cdr--Coker;

AF 1 LCol--Daughtrey; AF 19 Colonels--Craner, Crow, Crumpler, Day, Dramesi, Finlay, Guarino, Gutterson, Hughes, Kasler, Johnson, Kirk, Lamar, Larson, Ligon, McKnight, Pollard, Stockman, & Webb; Navy 18 Captains--Brady, Coskey, Crayton, Daniels, Doremus, Fellowes, Franke, Gillespie, James, Jenkins, McCain, Moore, Mulligan, Rivers, R utledge, Schoeffel, Stratton, & Tanner.

2 Became U.S. Congressmen (Johnson, Texas; McCain, Arizona).

2 Became U.S. Senators (Denton, Alabama; McCain, Arizona).

1 Was a Vice Presidential candidate (Stockdale).

1 Was a Presidential candidate (McCain).

2 Received the Medal of Honor (Stockdale, Day). Day resumed his career as a lawyer.

3 Received the Navy Cross (Denton, Coker, Fuller). (3 of the 4 POWs to receive this award were from this room.
Red McDaniel was the 4th POW to receive the award.

4 Made escapes. All were recaptured, all were tortured. (Dramesi, Coker, McKnight, Day).

2 Were jet aces from the Korea War (Risner: 9 kills in F-86; Kasler: 6 kills in F-86).

1 First pilot to fly over Russia in U-2 spy aircraft (Stockman).

1 Was shot down 4-15-1944 in Germany. POW until April 1945. 26th mission in P-47 (Ligon)

1 Shot down 3 German planes during WW II. Flying British aircraft (Guarino). Flew 156 missions in Sicily, India, China and Indo-China.

1 Flew 62 missions in Korea War. Got credit for 1 kill, 1 damaged, 1 probable kill against Mig 15s (Johnson).

7 Received the Air Force Cross (Kasler--3 awards; Risner--2 awards; Dramesi:
2 awards, Day, Kirk, Guarino and McKnight each received one award).

4 Were Navy Test Pilots (Stockdale, Lawrence, Gillespie, & Franke).

1 Flew with the Thunderbirds (Johnson).

11 Were USNA graduates (Brady '51, Denton '47, Fellowes '56, Fuller '51, Gillespie '51, Lawrence '51, McCain '58, Rivers '52, Schoeffel '54, Shumaker '56, and Stockdale '47).

2 Were Landing Signal Officers (LSOs); (Stockdale, Tanner).

1 Escaped the B-52 community and got into comb at flying the F-105G (Larson).

1 Lawrence, has a daughter who is an astronaut, gone into space three times (789 hours). She is presently in training as a crewmember of the International Space Station.

1 Was a Navy Air Wing Commander (CAG): (Stockdale, (COMAIRGRU 16).

1 Fuller, commanded a Navy Carrier, the USS America. Later became Battle Group Commander CARGRU 4 Commander. Fuller

10 Were Squadron Commanders (Coskey (VA-85), Day (TBD), Denton (VA-75), Franke, Fuller (VA-76), Gillespie, Jenkins VA-163), Lawrence (VF-143), Ligon (11th TRS) and Larson (469th TFS) when shot down), Schoeffel (VA-83).

5 Were Squadron Executive Officer s (Daniels, Moore, Mulligan, Rutledge, and Brady. They were shot down before they could make Squadron Commander.

10 Authored books:

a. Day: Return With Honor.

b. Denton: When Hell Was In Session.
c. Dramesi: Code of Honor.

d. Guarino: A POW's Story : 2801 Days in Hanoi.

e. Johnson: Captive Warriors: A Vietnam POW's Story.

f. McCain: Faith of My Fathers. This was also made into a movie.

g. Mulligan: The Hanoi Commitment.

h. Risner: The Passing of the Night.

i. Rutledge: In the Presence of Mine Enemies.

j. Stockdale: Courage Under Fire; In Love and War; A Vietnam Experience; Thoughts of a Philosophical Fighter Pilot.

4 Became Presidents/Commandants/Superintendents of institutions of higher learning: Stockdale:President of the Citidel and President of the Naval War College; Lawrence: Superintendent of the USNA; Shumaker: Superintendent of the Naval Postgraduate School; and (TBD); Denton: Commandant of Armed Forces Staff College).

2 Glassairuilt and Jenkinstheir own airplanes. Jenkins, Long EZ, Shumaker, Glassair. Pollard is currently flying sail planes.

1 Was the first active duty Naval Aviator to fly Mach II (Lawrence).

1 Gillespie was first Naval Aviator to land on an aircraft carrier in 0/0 fog with a newly developed Aircraft Carrier Landing System. Yes, it was an emergency low fuel state!

2 Lawrence and Shumaker Naval Aviators were in the final selection groups (before shootdown) for the Mercury Astronaut Program
Many of the members of Room 7 either served during wars prior to Vietnam, or saw combat in theatres other than Vietnam


Vern Ligon: USA Air Corps, 25 missions, P-47 pilot, POW in Stalag Luft 1, 1944-45, escaped once, recaptured.

Larry Guarino: USA Air Corps, 156 missions in Sicily, India, China and Indo-China. Spitfires.

Hervey Stockman: USA Air Corps. 68 missions, P-51.

Jim Kasler: USA Air Corps, 7 missions as tail gunner, B-29.

Harry Jenkins and Gordon Larson were Navy V5 cadets and Fred Crow was an Army Air Corps aviation cadet when WW II ended.

Bud Day: Corporal, USMC, 30 months in south and central Pacific, April 1942-Nov 1945.

By Fuller and Carl Crumpler: Enlisted in US Navy summer of 1 945. Saw boot camp by the end of WW II.

Fred Crow and Al Brady: were Navy dependents at Pearl Harbor, December 7, 1941.


Robby Risner : USAF, 108 missions, F-86. Mig Ace with 9 kills.

Jim Kasler: USAF, 100 missions, F-86, Mig Ace with 6 kills. < br> Howie Rutledge: USN, 200 missions, F9F-2 as a Flying Midshipman.&nbs p;

Harry Jenkins: Served aboard USS Fred T. Berry (DD-141) off coast of Korea. Flying Midshipman.

Tom Kirk: Flew missions in Korea.

Larry Guarino: USAF, Air Defense Alert missions.

Jim Lamar: USAF, 100 missions in F-80 and P-51.

Wendy Rivers: Served on a destroyer off the coast of Korea.

Laird Gutterson: USAF, flew 60 missions, P-51.

Verlyne Daniels: Flew AD-4 missions, March-August 1953.

Sam Johnson: USAF, flew 62 missions, F-86, 1 kill, 1 probable, 1 damaged against Mig 15s.

Bud Day: USAF, air defense missions, F-84s.

Bill Lawrence: (F2H-3) and By Fuller (F9F-5) arrived off the coast of Korea in October 1953. They were flying off the USS Oriskany. Too late the war was over!

Fred Crow: Had various commands stateside during the Korean War.

Carl Crumpler: Flew F-86s at George AFB. War was over too soon for him to participate.

Magnificent men, all, whether in a cockpit, in a cell, or at a desk. Provided to show that, regardless of the circumstances, some are never defeated, only temporarily delayed.

All of this and some SOB says, "getting shot down and captured does not qualify someone to be president"
but the mutt, with 143 days in congress does qualify? What a country, but how long will we stand at this rate?


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